Paul: 0:29

And welcome to this week's MarketPulse pros and pioneers. I'm Paul the host here and every week we speak to business leaders, senior marketers, and startup owners who are all trying to do the same thing. Make marketing work for their business and for their clients. This week's no different, we have the fabulous Monika Elling. Hello Monika, how are you?

Monika: 0:50

Yes, good morning. Lovely to be here.

Paul: 0:52

Thanks for coming along, thanks for coming along. So Monika is the CEO and founder at Foundation Management Group, FMG who are dedicated to creating award winning brands in the wine and spirits industry. Monika's got a diverse background that, that kind of spans across marketing, PR, brand management, and she's made some significant strides in transforming how brands connect with their audience. Multicultural background and fluency in multiple languages. Not least of which is Monika being a leader in a, what is traditionally a male dominated industry. Great to have you on board, Monika. And I can see from your background that you've already led Empress Gin to a 200 million plus exit. And lots of success in the industry. Great to have you along. First question before we go anywhere else. Why wine and spirits?

Monika: 1:38

I fell into the business as so many in this industry do. For me, my background originally was in advertising and publishing, and specifically in the luxury goods segment. So there was that whole intentional career path for me, Madison Avenue. Saatchi and Saatchi subsidiary and going from there. I should add that in the early days, there was an awakening for me, which I didn't realize at the time how profound it was going to be, but I had the pleasure of working with Michel Roux of Absolute Vodka Fame during the heydays. of when he put that brand on basically every back cover or centerfold of all the publications, all the luxury glossy publications. And what was happening was this whole new world of bringing a spirits brand to life. The campaigns were imaginative, incredibly well thought out, connected to consumers. In ways that no alcohol beverage brand had done before. So that work relationship had a profound impact on my understanding of and my development in brand building as a concept. And then I did about a decade of international trade and business development working with mostly emerging markets. And at that time Hungary was the priority for me in terms of the post communist era. There were a lot of companies coming into the region for historic vineyards. We had Antinori, AXA, Melissa May, and many others that were there at the time. And so what happened for me with those connections is somehow I woke up one day and I found myself in the wine business.

Paul 2: 3:37

Fantastic background and lots of learnings here. So a lot of our audience are traditionally quite a small to medium sized business owner. And I know from experience there's a lot of people in those sorts of industries where we're trying to differentiate ourselves in what is quite a crowded market. And I think that there's a lot of learnings that we can transpose from your experience in wine and spirits industry to lots of other industries that are immediately connecting and that can really help small business owners to break out of their own box. First of all, you speak three languages. What languages do you speak, Monika?

Monika: 4:12

My native tongue is Hungarian and then I went to school in Austria. So I learned German. And lastly, I had to learn English and that was all within about an 18 month period. I went to five schools in three languages, two of which I did not know. That became my superpower as in. If I could do that and survive and be sane, then I could do anything.

Paul 2: 4:41

That's amazing. And to hear that English is not your first language blows me away because I love speaking languages. I'm diligently working my way through Spanish with my son, who's six, cause I want him to learn a lot earlier than I ever learned. And he's picking it up at, he picks it up much quicker than I do. But to hear your accent, you can barely tell that you have anything other than American accent. So that's a phenomenal skill set that you have. And I'm not going to lie. I'm a little bit jealous. Has that helped you with your marketing and sales capabilities in terms of being able to reach markets where perhaps English isn't as well spoken?

Monika: 5:19

don't think it's so much about knowing the language. It's the sense that I understand different cultures very well. And even if I don't understand a specific culture, I can surmise what the initial things I would have to consider in my marketing would be. And as a result, I, Immediately think about any brand that I'm involved with on a global basis. So that means a focus on the cultural bent of the people that will be receiving that product and how they will think about it. So I'm not boxed into my little geographical universe, nor linguistic universe for that matter.

Paul 2: 6:06

And I think that transpires into you working in what is traditionally a male dominated world as well, right? You've got a very different viewpoint on things that I can tell that you're very passionate about getting that across to people. And we probably have, at least, 60 percent of our audience is a female demographic, so great to have somebody on the show who can speak to that, having been there and gotten there. What sort of barriers were in place in that industry that you found were holding you back, and how did you overcome those in that world?

Monika: 6:34

I think I'm still overcoming them. And truth be told it's a journey. So from the beginning I recognized that. I was most often the only woman at the table, literally, whether it was a management table for looking at new products on the wholesale side, or whether it was a sales meeting or a producer event it was at the time when I was starting out, I was predominantly the only woman there. So that, that was. Just something I recognized. I didn't really consider it a challenge. I wasn't even thinking about it. Frankly, my, my goal was to improve my professional standing, my knowledge, and bring that to my organization, to my customers and clients. So that was my focus. That said, as I was looking to advance my career, I smashed a few glass ceilings, but then I really encountered one. I hit hard. And at that point, I decided to pivot and go out on my own. I had a situation where I wanted to go. I and I was accepted for an international MBA program, wine specific, that would have required. 12 weeks within a two year window to be out of the office, if you will. And that would translate to six weeks per year. I was a director. I didn't feel that it would diminish my work. In fact, my goal was to improve my qualifications and my knowledge and bring that to my organization. But I had a sit down meeting at that time with. The president and the management team, all of whom were men, and whether it was because they were men or not, the question came up immediately. Then are you going to want our jobs when you come back with that MBA? And I just looked and thought, how short sighted is that? I would think that you would want me to bring value to the organization. So I recognized that they were not going to let me go to do the program. And then I was just carving out my time to launch my own business, launched an agency a year and a half later and never looked back.

Paul 2: 9:37

I just don't know. Interesting in terms of, the fact that they felt threatened. And I think that, that speaks volumes of the culture at the top level in many businesses, to be fair. I think we surround ourselves traditionally with people who are capable of doing a job, but the moment that they show that real creativity and desire to push forward, it can be a threat directly to the business. And you've got to be comfortable enough in your own shoes to grow around that and have people around you who are actually smarter than you. Something I learned a long time ago. How does,

Monika: 10:10

I would just add that it happened to be all men. At that table, and I had already been a top performer. I was business development professional of the year. I was a director. I was wearing two hats within a major organization, but it could have been women at that table too, and that. Threat, if you will, that could occur whether it's men or women at the table. So I've recognized that other times in my life and it's something I acknowledge. So I'm not just going to put it to the level of it's men deciding my fate. So I think it goes in different directions.

Paul 2: 10:51

yeah, but also interesting to hear that you didn't really see it as a challenge yourself for the majority of that time. And I think that's true of a lot of people who are successful is they recognize that there are obstacles out there, but they don't really see those things as challenges. They are just so driven and focused on their own progression, development, their end goals. And it's great to see that you finally achieved that. The sorts of role that you wanted to get into in the first place. If you can't get there by any other means, make it happen yourself. And I think that's a great lesson for anybody that's out there. That's aspiring in similar shoes. To bring it back a little bit to the wine and spirits industry. Like that's a, it's a fairly traditional industry, right? It's, we've always done things this way. This is how things will be done. Nothing really much changes. People will always want to drink wine and spirits. Why do we need to be different? What's the coolest thing that's happening with wine and industry right now that you've seen?

Monika: 11:43

I, I believe that the opportunity for innovation and I do believe that this is across CPG not just at Wine and Spirits, but Wine and Spirits specifically has been hampered by this thinking of this is what we produce. This is what's new. Traditionally working in the marketplace. The routes to market are traditional. A lot of times are hampered by all sorts of strange regulatory confounds. And it's. It's, I think, the companies that are looking to break through those established pathways that are going to be leading the industry forward. So I think that the opportunity to innovate, I'm not saying the innovation is there. It is to some degree starting to show. I don't think it's anywhere near where it can be yet. And that's what's exciting for me to think about.

Paul 2: 12:42

So on the back of that then, you obviously helped Empress Gin to a 200 million plus exit, which is a fantastic achievement. I'm sure there's lots of people who are listening to this who are aspiring to a similar sort of exit. What trends do you see coming in 2024 2025 for businesses who are looking to exit and how does brand and website and experience impact on all of that from your perspective?

Monika: 13:08

So To be clear, Empress was run by a private equity group who came to us with an acquisition that they made and we created the brand, the strategies, everything, the voice, everything that went into that brand and deployed that brand. So I hired the sales force and all of that the goal with Empress in my view was and not just Empress, any brand I touch, it's really understanding what segment of the market we're going after and drive that home. And the part that companies in this space miss very often. Is that it really starts in the beginning. So oftentimes I'm brought in to fix something that's broken or it's not working properly and much of that very often has to do with the brand itself and everything that they had done to date. I have four brands in front of me today. That have a modicum of success or what the brand owners are translating to as we're showing traction. And I take one look at it and in order for that brand, in my view, to have that type of a exit thinking, realistically, It goes back to the brand itself and everything around it and the strategies that have been used to create that brand and how they have deployed it. So where so many companies, wine and spirits shortcut the process is at the beginning or at the foundational level. So I call my company Foundations Marketing Group because the foundations have to be there. And if they aren't. As you're looking to work with us, I go back and we fix that. We have to fix it in order for that brand to have an opportunity for that exit. And not just the exit, but success with the consumer. The exit will take care of itself if you have that connectivity with the consumer. And that's what I focus on. Because I want people who are passionate about whatever that brand is and what it stands for. The other issue is they could have elements of it that don't align. I always look for alignment or create the alignment between product quality, taste profile, and taste first, and then everything else has to align. over achieve on that flavor profile. So the expectation should be that when the consumer connects with that brand on a digital or physical shelf, they have an impression. And then when they actually taste that product it, it enhances the original impression. If it falls short, there's no chance.

Paul 2: 16:10

Do you think that alignment needs to flow through the team as well on the back of that? So you've got that product and customer alignment, but then to have alignment between sales and market and the relevant stakeholders within the business, is that something that you see produces a lot of external problems that the business themselves struggle to articulate or understand that is even there?

Monika: 16:31

When that occurs, and it occurs very often, it's because they miss that fundamental element that I just referred to. And if the alignment is there on the brand side and the messaging, the voice, everything is in sync. And that work has been done, then it's easy enough to get it across your internal and external teams because messaging is strong, it's focused, it's direct, it's differentiated, and it's connected. So when you have those elements, then that alignment will exist naturally. When you don't have that alignment, which is 90 percent of the brands, then you have miscommunication. It doesn't translate through the food chain and ultimately people are just making up stuff about what the messaging should be instead of being super clear and to the point

Paul 2: 17:32

So then, I guess to translate that to small to medium businesses, so what we're saying here is that actually the fundamentals that you're often called in to fix need to be in place a lot sooner than in place at all even in some businesses, right? And I know from a small business owner perspective, brand is something that you yeah, we'll do that tomorrow when we've got revenue. We need to build some revenue first before we can get on with the brand and they might be short of resources or capital in order to pay somebody who's worth paying to do the brand because there's brand marketers and there are brand marketers and we know that there's two different, very different camps in the world. So at what point would you say a business needs to start thinking about taking their brand very seriously? Before they get too big. What is, what's the turning point? What are the indicators or the triggers that you see where they should start to think before it gets too late?

Monika: 18:24

So I would say we, we hear the word product market fit often in, in every aspect of business, small, medium, large, it really doesn't matter. You have to have product market fit. And I think a lot of brand owners misread the signals early on because they're convinced that their friends and family and the people that they show their product to love the product. They even have some sales. And so they say we can just do more of this and then we'll take care of everything else. The challenge with that, and I understand, I completely understand the small business mentality of where to put your resources. And then those scarce resources in the beginning are really hard to allocate. If you don't get the brand. And this component, right? You're not going anywhere. That's part of it. It's an analogy I would look at would be more along the lines of your personal health. So you are not taking care of your personal health and you're just thinking that at some point, some stage I'm going to do that, but you're eating all the junk right now because that's cheaper. That's easier. And you like it later on. You're going to pay a price. And that price is, could be death to the business. It's a death blow because when you've created the brand and you've set yourself on a specific course, you are going to have to allow a level of autopilot to occur for the brand pull through from the consumer side. And if those elements aren't there, you're just not going to get that kind of traction. So I recommend highly that it's in. In the beginning, as early as possible, in fact, do not undertake branding within your family unless you're experts at it. Very often, small business oh, my, my cousin had a great idea and it's it's called Yellow Fox. Vodka. Fantastic. Except now you're four years in, you're grinding and you've hit a ceiling and now you want to fix it. Except the problem is it's called yellow fox vodka and nowhere on the planet are you going to make this work?

Paul 2: 20:50

Some great insights, Monika. I love the translatability of that into lots of other industries. Cause I see the same problems in SAS software and beyond. So some interesting insights. To the core questions that I ask all of our guests on the show, I'm going to phrase it slightly differently this time, but it's the same question is what's one thing that small businesses do that really grinds your gears in terms of marketing? What do you wish they would stop doing? And it can't be branding, right?

Monika: 21:18

No.

Paul 2: 21:19

attention to branding. That's

Monika: 21:20

No I, again, small business as in the small business as a company itself, you have to have a business proposition that sets you apart. And that's a fundamental question you have to answer. Why do I, why does this business exist? Or why does this brand exist? It's the why, what is your purpose? And what sets you apart from everybody else? And if you can't answer that question, that brand should not exist. That business should not exist because you have to have something compelling to the marketplace. It really doesn't matter about anything else and what kind of products you churn out. Differentiation is key and your purpose to exist.

Paul 2: 22:08

I love that. I love that. And to flip that question on its head. What's one thing that you wish, like, when you have clients come to you, that you wish that they had done long ago with regards to their market, what do you wish that they'd fixed? And again not allowed to have opposites.

Monika: 22:24

Yes, I go back to this very fundamental element in every instance, where I see the issues that are coming up and it all goes back to their pillars and the fundamental strategy. They feel they can fly by the seat of their pants and you pay a price for that. www. microsoft. com You really do. It hampers your growth. It could completely deaden your growth. And ultimately it won't allow you to execute in a seamless way. And ultimately you want to be executing in a seamless process. But you can't do it if you don't have your initial strategies in place. Too many small businesses just wake up in the morning and grind and there is no thought to that. There's no space for it in their minds because they're busy surviving. So you have to carve that out.

Paul 2: 23:25

Yep. Too busy thinking about the sand. And the things that can be done by pretty much anybody that will probably happen all on their own if you let them. As opposed to breaking down the big rocks that sit at the top of the business that you're trying to avoid because they're quite hard to think about and articulate, right?

Monika: 23:42

I'll give you an example. Yes. So I'll give you an example that's happening right now. I had, I have a client that brought in They established their U. S. operation. They brought in X amount of 6, 000 cases of wine. And then the question came how do we actually now do this? So the strategy was, on the one hand to create a sales platform and all that, but they didn't answer the practical questions in the beginning. And now they're looking for solutions and who can help with bridging that aspect of that business that they just launched. And these are serious people, so it's happening at every level.

Paul 2: 24:33

And that kind of solution then has to be tailored around the mistakes that have already been made or the situation that already exists as opposed to being a natural, Solution to a problem that could never have happened in the first place.

Monika: 24:44

Yeah.

Paul 2: 24:45

I think I'd like to think that from our conversation, Monika, like a lot of our audience came to the episode a little bit bemused by the fact that I brought someone who's an expert in the wine and spirits industry to traditionally what is not a wine and spirits audience, but I hope everybody can now see what I saw at the beginning, which was, there's a lot of crossover between the two industries. There's a lot of learnings that people could take from your experience, the things that you'll see in, in that industry as a unique industry that are quite applicable to a lot of other things. If somebody is interested and they've heard what you've said, and perhaps they know somebody who would benefit from working with you guys, how can people reach out and learn more about you, Monika? And how can they contact you for a business purpose?

Monika: 25:26

Very easily through LinkedIn, I have a booking link on my page and I can also be reached off our website at fmg.nyc. We're Manhattan based and happy to have a discussion regarding any level of business or brand questions.

Paul 2: 25:46

Perfect. Thank you very much for your time today, Monika. It's been an absolute pleasure to speak to you.

Monika: 25:51

Lovely meeting you, and it was a great conversation, enjoyed it tremendously.

Paul 2: 25:55

Awesome. And if you're a listener to the show or a viewer of the show, you'll know that we release every Wednesday at 3pm UK time. Thanks very much for coming along to another episode of MarketPulse Pros and Pioneers, and I will see you next Wednesday. Bye bye.